According to the Vatican’s envoy in Libya, 40 civilians were killed in a recent airstrike:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/31/tripoli-air-strikes-killed-civilians
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It isn’t immoral when Obama does it!
http://orgtheory.wordpress.com/2011/03/29/democrats-killed-the-antiwar-movement/
Yes, the triumph of partisanship. In like manner, one suspects that Republican critics of the war in Libya would be on board if it was W doing the bombing.
It is not partisanship to ask if the UN report was accurate, is it?
Does the UN accurately know if “civilians” who were killed, were actually rebels dressed in civilian garb, or Khaddafi partisans also in civilian garb? Were they an extended family group having the Libyan equivalent of a Bar Mitzvah?
We know the rebels are wearing civilian clothing, as are some of the government’s supporters. We know that both sides use Toyota pickups to get around. So do the civilians.
If two sides of a war insist on fighting that war in their own city streets and neighborhoods, there’s one thing that is sure to happen. There will be casualties inflicted on the innocent.
The question that needs to be asked, by those in the middle of the fighting, is this. Is the result, worth the cost?
Only they have the answer.
Thank you for making the case against the morality of modern warfare.
If two sides of a war insist on fighting that war in their own city streets and neighborhoods, there’s one thing that is sure to happen if they have oil. The US government will come in and indiscriminately drop bombs on both sides, killing many innocents
Fixed that for ya, buddy.
Is there any difference in the morality of war, be it carried out by modern means, or otherwise? All warfare is intrinsically bad, for the whole process is to destroy an enemies ability to fight.
In the words of Gen’l Sherman: “All war is pure hell.”
In this case, some (15-40) supposed civilians were killed by airial attack and this event is chosen to illustrate the deadly and terrible results of war.
Why?
I think that in this case, the deaths came as a result of bomb(s) from a western aircraft. As such, it is easy for the usual leftist crowd of America haters to condemn the bombs and by extension, the forces that used them.
However, intellectual honesty forces me to ask the following question.
According to reports from the Catholic relief organization Caritas, between 800 to 1000 men, women and children, were slaughtered in the Ivory Coast on the same day as the Libyan event. These poor souls were shot or butchered by machetes and hacked apart. Not casualties of a modern war, but casualties of an even more deadly and bloody action.
Where is the moral indignation over this?
Because the usual suspects cannot point an accusatory finger at the west, this event is ignored and all we hear, is the sound of crickets.
If the Ivory Coast had oil, we would be bombing them, too.
I don’t know about the “usual leftist crowd of America haters”, and I don’t know anyone who would admit to belonging to such a crowd, but as for me criticizing my own government’s actions takes precedence.
As for modern warfare being intriniscally different from traditional war, since WWII every conflict has resulted in more civilian deaths than military ones.
Your indiffernce to the death of innocents is astounding.
You chose to ignore the slaughter of nearly 1000 old folks, women and children, hacked apart with machetes as beneath your notice. Because they do not have oil in the Ivory Coast, these horrible acts of murder action cannot be pinned somehow on the USA and so, do not rise to your attention?
That attutude defines indifference.
It is quite obvious that by your comment, “but as for me criticizing my own government’s actions takes precedence.” you make abundantly clear where your focus is.
Is indeed to be part of the America haters, the Blame America First crowd
No, I do not ignore the tragic deaths of innocents, wherever they occur. However, as a citizen of a nation that calls itself democratic, I feel more liable for the killing that is done in my name, with my dollars.
An America hater? I don’t think so. As Neil Young, a Canadian writing in a totally different context, said “Only love can break your heart.”
Mr. Gallanders’ remarks and his logic puzzle me. Libyans are killing Libyans, and some of the fighters are not in regulation military uniforms – (reminds me perhaps of our our revolutionary war, but that’s beside the point). Therefore the United States is justified in intervening and if some civilians get killed, that was their fault because they might have been soldiers. Is that your arguement, Mr. Gallander? And anyone who opposes the U.S. dropping bombs on a country with which it is not at war clearly is a leftist and hates America? And since evil men can kill civilians with machetes, therefore the obviously far greater number that can be killed at one stroke, so so speak, in aerial warfare is not a greater moral evil? I confess I don’t follow your argument.
Admittedly war is ugly, but if you simply say, War is evil, that’s it, you inadvertently open the door to all kinds of atrocities on the grounds that killing is always bad, so there. There is a big difference between a Christian knight defending his realm against unjust invaders and a [pick your own least favorite army here] soldier killing civilians, raping women, pilaging, etc. Even in war we are bound by the law of God and can, if we wish, avoid mortal sin.